Megan Martin 0:00
This is talking small business with Kat Schmoyer and Meghan Martin, a podcast for creatives who like to keep it real about what it actually takes to grow an online business.

Kat Schmoyer 0:09
We’re competitors turned to biz besties who chat daily and now we’re bringing you into the conversation.

Megan Martin 0:20
Hey friend, welcome to another episode of talking small business, Meghan here and today we are going to chat about building a business in 2021. It is right now and then beyond if you’re listening to this later, but building a business in our digital age, when you also want to have boundaries around social media. So Kat and I have not planned this conversation at all as normal. And we’re just gonna dive into and explore this conversation. This is something that actually we have had random Vox conversations over the past few years, we’ll just randomly bring up the concept of like, okay, let’s have a check in a gut check about how we feel around our social media lives, I would call it such a weird thing that first of all, this is weird. Okay, do we do you feel like the like, online world is weird, sometimes cat

Kat Schmoyer 1:18
ideal, because it almost feels like split personalities, like you have the online world. And like the things you’re seeing on Instagram and online conversations, but then there’s like real life? And yes, there are things that intertwine the two I mean, you and I like we were online friends, and then we met in real life and became real life friends. Yeah, but I just still, it’s just so weird world to live in, where there’s so much of our life online, but then also the actual reality of what’s happening in our homes.

Megan Martin 1:46
Right. And so I feel like in 2021, there’s this expectation as business owners that we need to be present heavily present on social media in order to grow a successful business. And I think that’s just it’ll be really interesting to kind of talk through this. So one thing I think we should start off with cat is talking about what are our boundaries? What are our boundaries look like currently? So tell us, what do boundaries look like on social media for you?

Kat Schmoyer 2:18
I about a over a year ago, I guess. Now I implemented a pretty strict social media boundary for myself, where I do social media free weekends. And so literally on Fridays, I’m like getting off of Instagram, like kind of the end of the work day, and then I’m not looking back at an Instagram or Instagram and Facebook. So when I say social media, that’s what I’m personally referring to like those two platforms. I’m getting off of Instagram and Facebook, the end of the day on Friday, and not thinking about it or looking at it until Monday morning. It is honestly like such a blessing. I love it. I love my social media free weekends, it was really interesting. When I first started doing it, the habit of trying to click of like going to click on that button, you’re just used to it, you grab your phone, and you click it like even if you’re like not even thinking about doing it, you just go to click it. So it was interesting for me to start to do other things on my phone, let me go to my pictures. Let me like look at pictures of my kids, or let me get my Kindle app and like, read a book for a little bit of time, especially when I started it. I was still nursing. And so I’m sitting there nursing a baby on my phone, you know, like what do I need to do. So giving myself other things to do was just really interesting to see how often I was trying to click on that app. But for me, it became a breath of fresh air to just get off of this space that I felt like I was so immersed in all the time, and just doing silly stuff, right? Like not not having real conversation, just scrolling for scrolling sake or getting sucked down a rabbit hole. That just was a time suck. And I didn’t mean to do it. And so having those weekends off, is really, really helpful for me personally with just the way that my heart responds to social media. Now, I will say that because I’ve been doing this now for over a year, there’s definitely been weekends that have been the exception. But I give myself that grace if like our family’s doing something really fun, and I just want to share about it on Instagram or maybe I have a wedding. And so strategically I want to share behind the scenes of that wedding on social media, then yes, absolutely. I’ll jump in and do some of that. So I like to feel like we should have grace within those social media boundaries of doing like what feels right in that moment, but also knowing like, hey, do I need to be sitting in bed at 930 on a Saturday night scrolling through Instagram? No, I don’t need to do that. That’s not healthy. That’s not strategic for my business. And so I need to implement a social media boundary on that. I love that.

Megan Martin 4:39
You’ve been doing that. You’ve been doing this for a while

Kat Schmoyer 4:41
now. Yeah, yeah. A year started Yeah, I just haven’t been able to stop now that I’m doing it.

Megan Martin 4:47
Yeah. I would love to hear how you say you said that. You know when you first started you had this habit of going to click to Instagram Do you delete your social media app. You just taught yourself not to click on Instagram,

Kat Schmoyer 5:05
I don’t delete them. Honestly, I’m just lazy. It’s like a delete re login. Like all the fate I’ve multiple Instagram accounts was like, I don’t have time for this on a Monday morning, the way that I have my phone set up, they’re sort of hidden. I mean, clearly I know where they are like now I know you know where to click to get to them, but they’re not front and center. So that I think is helpful to know like, these are tucked away a little bit more. And then I have the apps that I do want to use on a regular basis more so like my reading app, or my my photos, like that kind of stuff in one certain section. So it’s like, that’s where I need to go. If I’m clicking on my phone, and if I’m jumping into something else, I probably shouldn’t be there.

Megan Martin 5:48
Mm hmm. I will say my boundaries look completely different. Like I don’t have a structure and there’s so just typical of our, you know, personality, just seven

Kat Schmoyer 5:58
versus if there are like tight Yeah, type a thing? Yes, yeah,

Megan Martin 6:02
I don’t have like, Hey, I don’t check social media on Saturday and Sunday, I have a much more fluid boundary, I would call it so for me. Let me be clear here. If you follow the consistency, marketing strategy, there’s nothing wrong with that, that’s a great strategy to follow, especially if you’re in a phase of your business where you’re trying to grow your audience, consistently showing up in your marketing efforts. And by consistently I mean, like, you know, people can expect on Mondays that you’re showing up an email, or people can expect on Monday, Wednesday, Friday, you’re showing up on an Instagram post, something like that, that’s very consistent. And your audience almost begins like waiting and looking for your content. If you’re following that strategy. That’s awesome. I did so as well in the past and teach that method because it is a good strategy right to follow to grow your audience, I do not do that anymore. I have been able to build my audience. And also my as I’ve grown my business, my marketing strategy has naturally shifted into more of a referral based strategy. So a lot of my new leads don’t come because I’m pumping out content all day, every day, they come because people are talking about my business, or they’re sharing a link to a sales page with their friends, or there’ll be in a Facebook group, and they’ll tag me and my company. So that’s been a huge blessing for me. But so that’s kind of where my social media boundaries come in. Like I found myself just over, like, burnt out, I guess is the word right? I found myself becoming burnt out through this consistency model and feeling like I had to show up and feeling like because I was following the consistency model, I had to show up in a certain way. And I couldn’t, I felt like I lost some of the freedom of my creativity in my social media world, because I was trying to like show up in a certain way at a certain time, in this consistent manner. And so I sort of let all of that go. Like, if you look at my feed, it’s actually I there’s probably like, I don’t know, 20 posts for an entire year. Like, that’s how quickly my feed spans from one year to the next. I show up a lot on Instagram stories, but I don’t ever have a structure to it. It’s just what do I want to talk about? And when do I want to talk about it. And that’s my kind of boundary. And I will tell you like, I don’t feel any guilt around that. I’m definitely not marketing my business the way as opposed to getting my business the way like marketing gurus would tell you to do it. But my business is fine. Like, our family is making money, I’m sure I’m gonna be real, I’m sure I can make a lot more money if I’m marketing my business more, you know, like if I actually put real effort into this, but in the season of life that I’ve been in, in the last two years with young kids. And, yeah, it’s so hard, it’s so hard to show up, especially when you have really young babies, and you’re a team of one or a team of two. And that way, so that’s been my boundaries. And I’ve I’ve actually been enjoying social media more that I let go of this facade of the way of like this consistency model and perfection model of showing up I

Kat Schmoyer 9:26
think you hit the nail on the head when you said like, but I’m actually happy, right? Like, and it’s kind of sad. If we think about our digital creative world, like, I feel like and maybe this is just me because I have my own assumptions and my own problems, I guess, with social media, but I feel like there are so many creatives who really struggle with social media and like we feel burnt out and we feel exhausted and the consistency game is really hard. And sometimes it’s the very last thing we want to do and we like force ourselves to fit this, like Instagram mold that we don’t necessarily want. And if we had our way and like our dream to dues for the week, it would not be something that we put out there. Or maybe it would, but it would be like on your terms, Megan, like you said, like, you’re like, I’m just gonna jump on and like, what do I want to talk about today? Or like, what do I want to share, and it would feel more creatively driven, versus like, I have to check these boxes, and like, how many real so I need to post and how many ways we need to comment and what hashtags we need to. And now Mark my words, none of those things are wrong. And there are incredible educators that teach on how to do that, and grow your business and, and do it really, really well. So I’m not knocking any of those things, it’s just sometimes feels like another to do. And that’s what makes it exhausting. And so I love that you said like, let’s just think about what makes us happy. And I feel like for so many of us, we don’t do that with social media, we do what we feel like we have to do in order to hit like x, y and z, rather than just saying like, but if I could actually do whatever I wanted on this platform, like what would it be? And I think that’s a really interesting question to ask ourselves when thinking about our own social media boundaries.

Megan Martin 11:08
Yeah. And I think for us, I think even like talking about the why behind even having this conversation is really important cat because for us, I think this conversation started because both of us have kids. And for me, I’ve been just really conscious in a meta way of my phone usage. And let me be clear, I am not the kind of person who is super diligent and disciplined about my phone usage. I use my phone probably way too much. And but I’m like, almost in this meta way, conscious of my kids watching me and what I’m doing. And I’m going to tell you, I am terrified of them getting a phone, I’m terrified, because my I am I’m 34 and I struggle with phone addiction, like I struggle with, not even just going to social media, but I struggled with boredom and picking up a device. And I didn’t get a device in my hand until I was in high school. And even when I got that device, it wasn’t an iPhone, it was a flip phone that like you had to text you had to press the numbers like a

Kat Schmoyer 12:23
pink razor, I was thrilled. But I got the pink razor. razor. Of course we did.

Megan Martin 12:29
Yes. No, but see, like, and we started our phone journey completely different than what kids start today, like people are handing kids who are 10 years old and iPhone, right? Can you imagine that if a 34 year old can’t control herself? What is a 10 year old gonna do? And so I think that that has been so heavily on my mind. And I think as I think that the education around social media is great, there’s some great educators out there to teach you how to use social media to benefit you in your business. So absolutely. Not knocking that as a an education or as something to do in your business. But business has become so convoluted with life, especially in the small business world. And especially because it’s not even just small businesses anymore, that have multiple team members. It’s like solopreneurs, like the solopreneur world, I feel like has blown up in our generation. And alongside of having these devices and so you can call up and bring it on me. I can call it that I’m working by being on social media, but am I really working? Am I really working right? Or am I am I just wasting time or distracting myself and now I’m doing it in front of my kids, because I am a one person team. And I’m the only person that can be doing this. Like, it brings up a lot of like deep and heavy conversation of, you know, what’s more important, what your kids are seeing you do or quote unquote, working or growing your audience or fill in the blank

Kat Schmoyer 14:07
range, right? No, I absolutely agree. I think it’s just as important as moms to think about that. And to think about like, that is such a huge part of our lives. And what do we want our kids to see when they’re seeing that and how do we want to like instill some sort of boundary that allows them to see what we want them to see you know, with how we’re responding to our phone and like the things that we’re doing I also think it just brings up like an interesting point of not just like what they’re seeing but also like you were mentioning like you know, I know how I feel being 34 like how is the 10 year old or the 14 year old like how are they gonna feel I think about that not just with like the addiction of the phone but with like the feeling social media brings up in me like I I know I’m not alone in this but like comparison competition like those are Things I heavily, heavily struggle with. And I have noticed, like massive changes, and I’m not saying that, like I’ve conquered it, but I have noticed massive changes with setting boundaries, like stretch, like for me like that social media free weekend like with setting that up? Because it takes How long do they say it takes for a habit to form? Isn’t it like three weeks of doing something? And it’s like, I think the habit is there? Well, for me, it’s like five days on two days off five days on to like there’s a constant break in the habit, right? So the habit doesn’t get to form whether that’s like a mental mindset habit, or it’s like the physical like, I’m just clicking on the app for no reason, you know, and so for me personally, as somebody that like comparison, just wrecks me. And competition is literally one of my top five and strengths finders. And so while I want to use that as a strength, it is also a weakness, it is also something that I see what somebody else is doing. And my enneagram threnody, like latches on. And I’m like, why am I not doing this, I need to do this, I need to hustle more workaholic tendencies, like all the bad things. So I need that two day off in order to just reset my mind. And remember, like, why am I doing what I’m doing? Who are the people I’m doing it for? Not that random girl on Instagram, but like my son, or my daughter, or my husband, like the people right here. And so that has been really helpful for me to have that like consistent break, both mentally and physically.

Megan Martin 16:22
I think that’s so smart to bring up the thought process of how long it takes to build a habit. So breaking, breaking, or having a break in your week does essentially break that out of it being Yeah, your go to it interesting, as well is that you said you know, comparison and competition are really big problems with you on social media. And for me, I would say that comparison and competition are not my personal problems, my problem I found. And one of the biggest reasons that I cut out the consistency model is that I am a rewards based person. So I I don’t know if you’ve ever watched the social dilemma. I think it’s on Netflix. It’s a documentary about social media and how it was designed. It’s fascinating if you haven’t watched it, so go do it. But I absolutely get that I think it’s like a dopamine hit, when you see like the like, or the comment or the DM like I get that like exciting, rushed feeling. And that’s almost like a reward to me, I put out a piece of content. And I check regularly to see if I got that reward, like that’s the honest truth. And I cut out the consistency model. And I stopped focusing on social media and my marketing strategies because that is like social media marketing is all based on this engagement, right? It’s like, every Instagram teacher who teaches talks about engagement is how you determine if you are being successful or not on social media. And so for me, um, be real with you like, there would be times that Jeremy and I would be in an argument. And instead of dealing with my frustrations towards my husband, I would go to Instagram and hang out with my online friends and like get my, like, be happy over here. And that’s like horrible giveaway, just look at that, but, but you’re

Kat Schmoyer 18:23
not the only one that does that, right? Like, it’s our escape, it’s like, Okay, I’m not gonna deal with this, I’m just gonna go click over here and like, see what these people are doing or chat in my DMS or whatever.

Megan Martin 18:33
Yeah, and so it be like, I you know, and IRL in real life, you know, I’d be, like, frustrated with my husband, and we’re not talking and so instead of dealing with that relationship, or that breakdown, I go and I talked to somebody else who wants to talk to me, quote, unquote, you know, and I got those like, I literally sensed myself like getting satisfaction if I saw that, you know, if I saw engagement or if I saw a comment or if I saw like, or whatever. And it was like a bandaid for what was happening in my real life. And I’m like, this is not healthy, like this is not a healthy way to live my life, either in real life or on my online life, you know? And so that was part of the reason why I said you know, I’m just going to break this I’m not going to be posting content for the for the goal of increasing engagement for the goal of increasing my followers anymore. Again, it’s this like, convoluted situation, I don’t have an Instagram manager. Like, that’d be great if I did, but I don’t you know, and I know a lot of people listening here, they don’t have a huge team, they don’t have somebody that can hand off Instagram or social media to in order to not have this problem. And so as small business owners, we have to figure out what a boundary could look like, even if that means making less money and for me, my relationships with my husband and my family are more important. than making more money, right?

Kat Schmoyer 20:03
I mean as it as it should be for for everyone out there, right? Like the actual relationships that matter should always Trump what’s happening online and what we feel like we need to do or have to do or whatever. So in light of that, Megan, I think it would be helpful for us to share and I know we’ve we’ve shared it a little bit already, but to like really hit the nail on the head with like, Okay, if you’re listening, if you feel like man, I need some social media boundaries. But you also were struggling with the consistency game, and feeling the need to check all of the boxes and do all of those things that are again, good things, things that can grow your audience, grow your reach, add more revenue to your bank account, like all of those things are good. But how can we find that balance? And so I would love to hear Megan, like, if you were sitting down with somebody right now, like, what would you tell them would be a great suggestion for a boundary template and place are a way to come to a conclusion on what that boundary should be?

Megan Martin 21:01
I think that it would depend on if you’re type A or type B, what my answer would be, you know, right. Like, if it’s a type a person like you, I would say, hey, you need to put it in your schedule you if you love to, like time block your life, and like, I know people who literally like down to the minute know what they’re doing in their life. If that’s you, then I would tell you that you need to make that a part of your schedule, you need to make that a part of your weekly systems set up whatever you call it, you people,

Kat Schmoyer 21:33
on your Trello board,

Megan Martin 21:33
do whatever, on your Trello board or on Sunday, if you sit down and use a calendar, I don’t know what that looks like. My point is, if you’re type A and that’s your, that’s your way of doing things, make it a part of your schedule, make it a part of your plan, and stick to that. And then I loved cat your suggestion of if you’re using it on your phone, your personal phone, hiding that app to where it’s not front and center that you actually physically have to like go to it. To get it I think another thing is adding something like moment is that what the app is called that can essentially it allows you to create time limits for apps. So you can create a time limit on your app, if you’re addicted to this. And you’re struggling with like even hiding it or whatever, just cheating, I would install something like moment to where it’s going to alert you and then it shuts you out of your phone essentially, if you don’t listen to it. But that’s a that’s a way that you could break the addiction. There’s other apps as well, we can research and link in our post if we want to. But that’s a suggestion I would give. But another thing you can do that Jeremy does is he makes his phone dumb. So he says that he has a dumb phone. And I don’t remember where he heard this and may have been on the Tim Ferriss podcast, but essentially, part of the way that phones were designed or is literally in the design, and it’s made to keep you sucked in. It’s not just social media platforms in general, like your phone itself, is designed very specifically to keep you engaged and tapping and clicking and exploring more and whatever. And so this concept of making your phone dumb is to is to make your brain less rewarded by using your phone. So one way you can do that is make your phone black and white. Jeremy’s phone does not have any color. And it’s really funny to look at. When he turns this. You can like literally turn the option to make your phone black and white. And it’s no idea. That’s Yeah, easy. It’s proven to like scientifically like your brain is bored. Your brain is bored of black and white color is really exciting. And so you’re much more likely to not or you’re much more likely to use your phone less if it’s in black and white than if it’s in color. Isn’t that crazy? That is that’s wild. Yeah. So that’s like one strategy you can do if you really are struggling with using your phone too much and you want to cut downtime, I would absolutely install an app and I would like moment and I would turn your phone black and white. If you’re like me and you’re type B and you would never schedule it your life down to the minute and if you do schedule your life down the minute you’re absolutely going to break it like because you just have to. Um, I think that I would challenge you to rethink your marketing strategy is social media. I would ask you the question. First is social media absolutely pivotal. There are business models where social media is pivotal. If you’re in the wedding industry, I do believe that social media is pivotal. There are other industries similar to that where I think that people are going to be searching for you on social media. And that’s going to be really tough for you to to step away from, in my case social media. I mean the majority would say social social media for digital business owner is pretty pivotal. But I mean, I don’t really use it that much in the way that I’m supposed to. And I’m fine. So I would challenge you on that. But if you’re in a business model where it’s absolutely essential, I would say, number one, can you hire someone? Can you hire someone to, and I don’t mean, of course, I would absolutely advise, like if you want to, if you have goals for social media, hire someone who’s this legit professional and social media marketing, right. But that’s not where you have to start. If we’re talking about creating a boundary and social media, because it’s it matters for your life, you don’t have to start with hiring the professional at Instagram or the professional at Facebook, that’s going to cost a lot of money. You could hire someone for an hourly job to take over Instagram, or maybe you batch content, you do it like once a week or once a month. And then you have an Instagram person or a Facebook person who social media person on your team. And their job is to look at the DMS Their job is to look at the messages. They’re the ones who are commenting and checking in to keep that engagement rate up. Like that would be my next step for somebody if that was like a pivotal, pivotal thing, and you could not step away for a certain period of time.

Kat Schmoyer 26:11
Yeah, I think all of that all of those are really good suggestions. I would also add, and I feel like this would go for either a Type A or type B. But of course Megan as our as our type beer, you tell me if this doesn’t work. I feel like with any goal, okay? Putting on like goal setting hat, I know, anti goal setting, but like bear with me here. Any if the goal is a social media boundary, then any goal will succeed. If not, I shouldn’t say they will always succeed, but has a better chance of succeeding, if you understand the why behind it. And so really analyzing like, why do you want a social media boundary? Like what is happening now that makes you feel unhappy? And how could life be different? If x, y and z is in place? So if your phone is black and white, or if the app is hidden? Or if you take weekends off? Or if once a month you take a week off? Or you know, something like that? Like, how is that going to make you feel different, and using that why as leverage to actually do the thing. I just I feel like that’s a really important, like mindset shift to start to have for me personally, with taking weekends off, that stemmed from not being happy with social media. It stemmed from being really jealous when I started to see other business owners announcing that they were taking a month off, or they were taking a whole year off. And then wondering, like, why am I so jealous of that, like, if this is my life, I can do whatever I want with my business, like why am I not building a business that allows me to do this thing that I really want to do. And I found that social media is somewhat pivotal in my marketing. So for me, I felt like taking a week off a month or a three months off, or a year off, like it wouldn’t work in my business model. So I started doing weekends to see like, could this work? Could this be like this little break and this little breath of fresh air, and then back to the grind Monday through Friday, and it has worked. And I think because of weekends off, it’s allowed me to actually start to create boundaries Monday through Friday, because I got used to that Saturday, Sunday rhythm. And that’s just one example. I just want to encourage you guys to like think about that, why, and then allow that to propel you forward when you decide what those boundaries need to look like, and not letting fear of that boundary keep you from doing that boundary. I feel like a lot of us worry about taking time off of social media or stopping the consistency marketing game because of revenue. And we worry like, will I stop getting clients? Will I you know, get left behind in my industry? Like will they miss out on like the latest and greatest? And I don’t I don’t think that’s a valid fear. I think that that I mean, there’s certain there’s there’s certain truth to you know, wanting to be up in the marketing game and know like what’s coming and like, take on things, you know, right when they’re starting. But I don’t think fear should be the propellant in your social media marketing. Yeah. So just understanding your why and then knowing like, Okay, how can I break this? If I really understand why I want to break it in the first place.

Megan Martin 29:22
Yeah. And I think I like that you brought up revenue because I was thinking the same thing in my mind that we’ve said it here on the podcast before, like, let revenue be the factor that helps you make your decisions. Like Of course, you’re right. the why behind this goal is super important. But if you start doing if you start implementing some practices to create boundaries, and your revenue drops off the planet, then maybe social media is pivotal. You need to get back on in some way, shape or form. But we do it in a way that is healthy for us like hiring someone like an assistant to help you or being strict about putting deadline Turning your phone black and white or any of those strategies, but I think you do have to be realistic that there’s an opportunity cost to every decision that we make, right? And so just like I’ve said, You know, I know that I could make more money if I showed up and was more consistent and actually talked about my business specifically on social media. I know it I’ve done it in the past when I do spend the time and effort to have a consistent solid social strategy around my business, I make more money, it’s just a natural thing. But for me, it goes back to you know, what is my life value and what am I like from a big picture? What am I trying to do and what am I trying to accomplish? And for me, I just rest in the fact that if I make enough right now then that’s okay. And I think that you have to make that decision for you like what is your enough number? And are you making that enough number? If not, then of course, we’re not going to just encourage you to drop off the face of the planet, your marketing, right we’re going to encourage you to keep going or you know, just make some good changes but if you’re making enough or if you’re making more than enough and you you’re you’re in this space of like unhappiness or jealousy, or you’re ignoring your relationships because you’re getting the dopamine hit that you need to when you see a comment roll through then maybe we need to have a heartfelt conversation of is it okay for you to take a step back in revenue in order to actually have the life that you’re working for having

Kat Schmoyer 31:46
human I love that the last thing to I want to share or just want to kind of like kind of end it with like positive poly note I guess on social media is we’ve I feel like we obviously this whole episode is around boundaries we’ve been talking about like what we don’t like or like the you know, our like struggles with social media because we have that they’re so real, and the ways that we have tried to, you know, tweak our routines and our mindsets and our marketing tactics and our business to make sure that they are can be more concrete boundaries. I also want to encourage all of you guys to think about like, What do you like about social media? And then leverage like that like leverage like what makes you happy on Instagram? Like not just the mindless scrolling but like, Is it just really funny to go down the rabbit hole of real sometimes like watch them with that silly Mom, dad? Or like, whatever? Yeah, sure. Okay, like be happy on social media or like, Do you enjoy Instagram story because then you’re getting to connect with your people in dm, like, that’s one of my favorite things. I love going into my DMS I love those conversations. And I know the people that DM me the most like we are like, I feel like more like in real life friends, even though we’re not actually in real life friends, because we get to talk so much on Instagram. So think about the things that like you enjoy about social media, and don’t take that away. But just figure out how can you set boundaries on the things that are unhealthy and that aren’t necessarily working well for you and your business and your personality? and lean into the things that do make you happy?

Megan Martin 33:15
I love that so much. And I absolutely agree there is good there is good to be had and to the experience on social media, our friendship cat is proof of that because we literally started as social media friends. So yeah, it’s not knocking social media. It’s finding a way to fit social media into your life, but not let it take over your life or take business. Alright friends, I hope this episode was encouraging and we will see you on social media sometime soon. And we’ll also catch you in the next conversation.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai